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#67415: "Number 5 never occurring while breaking safe"

confirmed: บัคถูกยืนยัน โดยผู้พัฒนา

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Burgle Bros. #280984132

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#	Status	Votes	Game	Type	Title	Last update

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Jul 6 th 2022 12:24 • Shpam • นักพัฒนายังไม่ได้ทำซ้ำข้อผิดพลาด:

That’s equivalent to winning euro millions 3 times in a row, we’re not talking about a « very unlikely » situation, it’s 1 chance out of 10^13, impossible.

Jul 6 th 2022 12:28 • Shpam • นักพัฒนายังไม่ได้ทำซ้ำข้อผิดพลาด:

Sometimes it says the the interface is blocked when I’m trying to open the safe, maybe it occurs when I’m supposed to make that 5 but the game doesn’t want it to be cracked.

Jul 8 th 2022 07:11 • Zilch • นักพัฒนายังไม่ได้ทำซ้ำข้อผิดพลาด:

My game is having the same issue, except with 3's instead of 5's. Table number 279148099

Jul 9 th 2022 01:16 • RodimusPrime • นักพัฒนายังไม่ได้ทำซ้ำข้อผิดพลาด:

I was at the same table as Zilch (#279148099).

FYI, in case this helps… I was the advanced Peterman character. So I was adding and rolling safe dice from the floor below in-between turns where Zilch was rolling too. I would usually get an “unstable interface” toast notification (Chrome browser on Mac) on my first mouse click and then my second click would perform my special action to roll the safe dice.

Jul 24 th 2022 06:31 • skriss • นักพัฒนายังไม่ได้ทำซ้ำข้อผิดพลาด:

I was having the same issue but with 3s instead of 5s. It kept repeating the same other numbers. Table # 285819563. We calculated the odds and the number of dice we were rolling our odds of never rolling that last 3 were 0.00003688002

Jul 24 th 2022 13:37 • cpasbanal • นี่ไม่ใช่ข้อผิดพลาด:

sorry guys but there is no issue on the randomization of die rolls, we use standard PHP and framework random rolling and it works well on all the games of BGA, this is just luck (or out of luck)

Jul 24 th 2022 14:54 • flakattack510 • นี่ไม่ใช่ข้อผิดพลาด:

I'm going to contest that a bit.

Last night, while observing skriss' game, there were two issues noticed:

1) There were several instances of duplicate sets being rolled on 4 die. The sets looked something like this (pattern is correct but the numbers aren't exact):

2,1,6,4
2,1,6,4

Next turn:

4,5,2,1
4,5,2,1
6,2,4,2
6,2,4,2

This was the most egregious example that I remember but there were several other ones showing an issue. The odds of getting three consecutive pairs of matches like that on 4 die are astronomically low (it's (1/6)^12, or roughly 1 in 500,000,000)

From my experience developing other applications, this is probably caused by a new RNG object being created for every set of rolls. Doing this in quick succession creates the RNG objects with the same seed, causing them to generate the same set of numbers. This can be fixed by creating a single instance of the RNG that is used for the entire turn or a single instance used for the entire game.

2) Players would intermittently receive an error when rolling to open the safe (was on a Skype call with the players who discussed it there). I suspect that the correct number was actually being "rolled" but it generated the error when rolled. This was observed after using the Peterman's drill ability to open a safe on a different floor. It was only seen when attempting to get the last number of the safe but I don't remember if the other numbers were rolled before or after the first use of the Peterman's ability.

It's possible that this is the cause of issue 1 and that rolling the needed number caused the game to "fall back" to the previous set of rolls when the error was encountered.

Hopefully this helps. We've really enjoyed the game so far.

Jul 24 th 2022 15:08 • Shpam • นี่ไม่ใช่ข้อผิดพลาด:

It’s absolutely impossible, it can’t be bad luck not to have a single 5 in 200 throws.

As I said, an error message occurred quite often, I believe it was when the die should have been 5 and the safe open, the bug probably comes from a bug happening when the safe opens.

Jul 24 th 2022 16:36 • Romain672 • นี่ไม่ใช่ข้อผิดพลาด:

It's not a problem with random though, it's a problem with the game itself.
On this bug:
boardgamearena.com/bug?id=42896
you said 'should be ok', so you doesn't seem to be sure and doesn't seem to have tested that.
Could there be that donuts are generated on that tile on that floor, the game doesn't like it, so don't allow that to happen and roll something else.

Jul 24 th 2022 16:38 • Romain672 • นี่ไม่ใช่ข้อผิดพลาด:

The date are coherent too, and both bugs seem to be about Peterman advanced. The first report of this bug is ~10 days after you fixed that other bug.

Jul 24 th 2022 19:34 • Rearden • นี่ไม่ใช่ข้อผิดพลาด:

Did you actually look at the game log? I suspect you did not.

It appears that the two players rolled 215 times for the safe on floor 1. The results were 41 ones, 43 twos, 43 threes, 44 fours, 0 fives, and 44 sixes.

I think you have a bug and I think you owe everyone here an apology.

Jul 24 th 2022 20:24 • Romain672 • นี่ไม่ใช่ข้อผิดพลาด:

Don't be that harsh Rearden, most complain about random are just false.
Here, the problem isn't the random, but something else.

But yeah that something is here: boardgamearena.com/bug?id=68285

Jul 25 th 2022 01:24 • RodimusPrime • นี่ไม่ใช่ข้อผิดพลาด:

1) Other BGA games don't give me the same instability symptoms. This is definitely a (tricky!) bug with the Burgle Bros application. Did you try to reproduce it?

2) And did you test with the advanced Peterman character? This is another common symptom.

Those are the 2 common reported symptoms. Please do your due diligence and test them. Instability bugs are always difficult to resolve, so I understand if you end up not being successful. But you have not provided sufficient evidence to call this 'notabug' at this point.

Jul 25 th 2022 21:39 • cpasbanal • บัคถูกยืนยัน โดยผู้พัฒนา:

thanks flakattack510 for your analysis, i'll check when i can

and for the record, i am a volunteer developer that doing this on my free time because i like the game and the spirit of BGA, insulting me or my work (or at least being rude) doesn't help at all ^^
and this is true for most of the games developed here

Jul 25 th 2022 22:56 • cpasbanal • บัคถูกยืนยัน โดยผู้พัฒนา:

@Romain672: fixed the other bug, not sure this is related (yet, it tampered with the Advanced Peterman)

Jul 25 th 2022 23:08 • BillC • บัคถูกยืนยัน โดยผู้พัฒนา:

game #286286280

I think flakattack510 said it all.

Not able to roll a 1 -- my math professor partner in the game says we are up to 1 in 9 million chance.

Peterman's Drill being used along with "normal" attempts.

Getting lots and lots of "error processing database request" messages -- about as often as the chance of rolling a 1 on at least 1 of 4-5 dice.

Jul 25 th 2022 23:12 • FlyingArrow • บัคถูกยืนยัน โดยผู้พัฒนา:

Bug occurs here as well: Game #286286280... almost 100 rolls with no 1 being rolled.

Same bug, and Advanced Peterman is in the game. Although it occurs for either player, not just Advanced Peterman. We got no 1s, and frequently got the database error: "Unexpected error: Error while processing Database request (reference: GS9 25/07 22:52:36)". Presumably that error happened whenever we would have actually rolled a 1.

This was on the 3rd floor. No problems on floor 1 or floor 2. Floor 3 was when the Advanced Peterman started to Drill, and the error started when we were down to needing only 1 number.

Jul 25 th 2022 23:57 • RodimusPrime • บัคถูกยืนยัน โดยผู้พัฒนา:

I said multiple times that what we actually have here is a tricky bug. I am sorry that that came across as being insulting. I do appreciate all of your hard work!

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#67415: "Number 5 never occurring while breaking safe"

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